Just like cooking wine takes away it’s chashivus for some things (i.e. Kiddush, daled cosos, etc) would the same be true if the wine was frozen then defrosted?

Answer:

Frozen and defrosted wine remains valid for kiddush.

Sources:

The Gemara discusses wine that is cooked, stating that this invalidates wine from being used for wine libations in the Mikdash. According to some authorities, this restriction applies even for kiddush, whereas others write that cooked wine is fine for kiddush. Both opinions are mentioned by the Shulchan Aruch (272:8), the Rema adding that the custom is to be lenient for using cooked wine.

Another dispute concerns cooking that does not appear to change the quality of the wine, such as modern-day pasteurization.

Concerning the question of frozen and thawed wine, there is no mention of this in the Gemara or by poskim, and therefore there is no reason to believe that the wine loses it’s inherent virtue by going though a solid phase.

Furthermore, many poskim rule that ices made of frozen wine or grape juice retain the hagefen berachah (see http://www.dinonline.org/2011/07/17/frozen-grapejuice/), and the rationale given by those who differ (see the link above) is the solid state of the wine, implying that upon thawing, there is no question that the blessing will be hagafen, and that the wine will be suitable for kiddush.

Note that this does not bear on the question of reconstituted grape juice, which many authorities maintain cannot be used for kiddush, and loses the hagefen berachah.

Tags: kiddush

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3 Responses to “Frozen and Thawed Wine”

  1. Although frozen and thawed wine is not mentioned in the gemorah there is a similar discussion in the poskim which one needs to look for in paskening these types of shailos.

    In the link provided to a different shailo it’s mentioned there a teshuvas Sheraga Hameir (3:32; 8:113). In the first teshuva he discusses the shailo at length of wine that became a solid (karush) what bracha should be made and in regards to kiddush (wine that became a solid in regards to some dinim *is* discussed by chazal as mentioned in the teshuva there.) He also deals with what would be the din when the wine becomes a liquid again. From my understanding of the teshuva he leaves the whole thing b’tzrich iyun. So why to be macria so fast over here in this case? Unless that we are assuming the accepted psak for using cooked wine is that it’s ok, which then this case shouldn’t be any “worse” than a case of cooked wine. The question arose originally in regards to Pesach and given a hechsher for wines and grape juices for daled cosos by a asifa of Rabbonim by the Eidah Charedis. This possible concern was raised when they discussed freezing wines and grape juices. The Sheraga Hameir I already knew I was curious to see other makoros. Thanks for the response.

    • Wine that becomes solid is mentioned in a number of sources, including a Mishnah and Gemara, and the sources mentioned in the linked teshuvah are based on this gemara. It is true that the Shraga Hameir discusses wine that thawed–thanks for pointing this out. Based partially on his opinion for solid wine, he considers this to be a safek. However, his logic, which is that it might be considered a change “ligrei’usa,” and that Chazal do not inform us of this point (whether the wine changes for the worse or not), is interesting. It can surely be argued that this can be ascertained, and if there is no change ligrei’usa, then there is no reason why the wine shouldn’t be good. In any case, according to the majority of poskim, even solid wine retains the hagafen blessing (see linked teshuvah), and of course the thawed liquid version won’t be any worse.

  2. In regards to what you said, “However, his logic, which is that it might be considered a change “ligrei’usa,” and that Chazal do not inform us of this point (whether the wine changes for the worse or not), is interesting. It can surely be argued that this can be ascertained, and if there is no change ligrei’usa, then there is no reason why the wine shouldn’t be good.”

    I agree on this point. Certainly it could be ascertained and like you said since chazal give no mention then seemingly one can assume it’s still ok. I wouldn’t be surprised if because of “chumra d’pesach” the hechshirim and olam would be machmir in this nakudah. It seems like freezing wine doesn’t change it for the worse in our. Usually freezing something keeps it in the state that it is, unless frozen for too long then possibly it could go bad but normally things are not frozen ‘go bad’ much quicker. The Shraiga Hameir’s case might be worse than freezing anyway, wine that became a solid doesn’t seem so appetizing and perhaps it became a solid for a particular reason which took down the ‘quality’ of the wine. In any case shkoiach for all the sources.

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